1998 ER5 problem starting.

[Murray]

Went up to leeds and back the other last weekend on my ER5. Had no problems at all. The night i got backi went to the pub and when i returned to my bike it struggled to start, after about the 5th attempt it was up and running. Got me home fine and all seemed fine. Same happened again the next day and eventually got it running. However now it just doesn't want to know. The starter motor is turning over and all the lights on the dash are working fine, its just not firing. Have cleaned the spark plugs and its still not going. Starter solenoid is starting to click a bit now, hopefully thats just down to me flattening the battery with my persistence. Is the regulator rectifier my source of problem or is there anything else I could try before parting with my cash? Just about to go out and see the the spark plugs are sparking up but any other ideas would be much appreciated. :reading

[DoodleBug]

Give the plugs a good clean

[Murray]

Give the plugs a good clean

Check. Already done that. :p

[Lateshift]

You are going to have to eliminate whether it is giving a spark first really before you actually start looking at the other possibilities, but at least we know its the ignition circuit that is responsible given that it turns over freely enough.

The clicking will undoubtedly be down to the battery being weakened with all the failed starting, in my opinion there is little point turning a bike over if its struggling to start, 2 things happen normally, the battery dies and the bike floods :)


So things to check are the spark plugs for now.

On the ignition circuit the regulator rectifier plays only a small part, its responsible for converting the higher voltage generated by the engine to one that the battery and circuits are capable of dealing with, in most cases its around 43 volts and 'rectified' down to around 15volts (this includes enough voltage to charge a battery whilst the bike is running its electrics.

The regulator part of it is what keeps the voltage in check with what the systems are using to run.

However the ignition is routed through a CDI unit (Capacitor discharge ignition) and normally an ECU both of which are linked to the starter circuit.

If you arent getting a spark, then you need to trace back through the ignition circuit, however the chances are it will be back in one of the units (my guess if its finally given up the ghost after a short period of intermittent starting) is that the CDI will have packed in as that is more likely to stop all the cylinders firing, if it had been firing unevenly then the chances are it could have been down to plugs, leads and coils.

It couldnt be something less sinister, like a dodgy connection too though :D

[Murray]

Having just bust the fuel line and making my garage smell like a petrol station it can be noted that both plugs are sparking. :mad:

[DoodleBug]

Well the next place to check is the fuel line, but it seems you already have :)

[Murray]

Well the next place to check is the fuel line, but it seems you already have :)

:grin1

[kasandrich]

Back to basics, you need 4 things to make an engine run.

1. Fuel (getting into the cylinder, mixed in the right ratio with air)
2. Compression
3. Valves opening and closing at the right times
4. Sparks (at the right time)


So if you have sparks (and we will assume for now they are at the right time), thats number 4. out of the way.

You have fuel and as you have 2 cylinders and 2 carburretors, we will assume a blockage would only affect one, so that 1. out of the way. But a quick and dirty check is can you smell petrol from the exhaust when trying to start it?

If the valves were not operating that would not have played up previously, so for now we will assume 3. is okay.

That only leaves 2. compression, does it sound like you have compression or does it sound like the engine is turning over too freely?

[Lateshift]

If there was a split in the fuel line then it would very likely draw air in on turn over too, which would stop it firing in most cases and also cause the fuel pump to prime constantly (which could flat the battery quite quickly).

How did you manage to split the fuel pipe and was it already perished?

[kasandrich]

From memory I am fairly sure the ER5 doesn't have a fuel pump

[Lateshift]

(excuse my ignorance :D :D )

I honestly wouldnt have a clue to be honest and i havent gone as far as looking up the parts diagram but it will still draw fuel under pressure somehow :)

[kasandrich]

I could be wrong, but I think its gravity feed, just means that there won't be the issue of it continuously priming.

I agree it could still draw air in.

[Murray]

Cheers for your help guys, won't be picking up a new few line until tomorrow when i get my gixer serviced, so no point trying much else till i get that sorted. Broke the fuel line at the connection to the tank as I rested the tank to get to the spark plugs, doesn't look like and i dont think there was anything wrong with it before my crazy hands got to work.

[kasandrich]

JUst a quickie worth trying, once the fuel is all connected back up, with the fuel tap on reserve, try undoing the drain screw on the bottoms of the carb float chambers, (from memory its brassy looking and right at the bottom of each carb) and confirm petrol comes out, (not water) this will prove there is no blockage from the tank to the carbs and that the float chambers are not full of water.

I specifically said on reserve because the fuel tap is vacuum operated, and will only allow fuel through if there is vacuum present, so it may be worth trying to start it on reserve, even if there is plenty of petrol, as this overides the vacuum requirement on the tap, and you could have for example a split in the vacuum pipe from the carb to the fuel tap.

[Murray]

Well little update here, fitted the new fuel line thursday and then yesterday I hooked it up to my gixer to give it some more battery power after I'd run it a down a bit. After a few attempts and a backfire (which bounced off the garage door and near deafened me!) I got it going. Left it running for a while, seemed to struggle a bit but was fine once it warmed up. However tried starting it again this morning with a cold engine, started fine. So........:confused: Anyway cheers for all your help guys, just hope i have no more trouble with it!