MSV Track Days

[MSV]

Hello Essex Bikers,

I have been looking around the website and haven’t seen much on trackdays. Does anyone attend trackdays from the club?

I work for MotorSport Vision – owners of Brands Hatch, Oulton Park, Cadwell Park and Snetterton, and we run our own trackday events. This year we are focusing on trying to encourage new participants onto our circuits to come and experience the fun and excitement of a trackday – particularly if you attend with friends or other club members and take advantage of our group booking discounts for riders wanting to attend a trackday together.

On our Sessioned trackday events riders of all abilities are welcome from complete novices to experienced track day regulars. We have also just released a new product ; Novice Only Trackdays – designed exclusively for riders with limited trackday experience.

All of our latest dates can be found at www.motorsportvision.co.uk/biketrackdays (http://www.motorsportvision.co.uk/biketrackdays) but if you have any questions then our advice is free so please don’t hesitate to call or email us on the number / email address below and we’ll answer any questions you might have.

I hope to see you at one of our circuits soon!

Nick Rice
Track Day Organiser
MotorSport Vision
Tel: 0870 850 5014
Email: nick.rice@motorsportvision.co.uk

[Jetski]

Hi there, welcome to EB. Thanks for the info on the MSV trackdays. There's loads of poeple on here that love doing track days! :grin2

Information on our gatherings, including group track days that are organised (there were quite a few last year!) are in a private section of the website that members can apply to join ;) :D

[Keir_K3]

I did an MSV track day at brands last sep. It was my first track experiance and i loved every minute of it. The price was just about the highest out there though so if this could be addressed then im sure more novices like myself would do more.

[MSV]

Thanks for the info.

If you get a group of you together for an event we can offer you a discount. This will obviously help a bit.

As i said above, we are looking to get more novices to come along and have a go at riding on a circuit. Im sure you'll agree that once you have been out once you really do get the track day bug!

[Keir_K3]

If any of the mods, or anyone really, arranges a group day out at brands i would certainly be there.

[Jetski]

Glad to hear it :D

I'm sure it's only a matter of time before another track day thing gets organised :)

[MSV]

To do a group booking you would just need one person to put a post up stating which day(s) would be preferable for everyone. Once you are fairly sure that there is a number of you wanting to book up, I would set a group booking folder up for you with the name of "Essex Bikers" for example. Individuals would just need to call me and leave their details. We would do the rest so there is no organisation or chasing of money done by the club members.

10 riders, 10% off. Any more than that we can discuss further offers.

If you are all based in and around Essex then both Brands Hatch and Snetterton would be our nearest circuits to you.

[stu600cc]

I wanna do snetterton let me know if any more dates come up

thx

[harriebird]

i'm doing snetterton on march 11th :skip

[stu600cc]

yeah march is a bit early may pop along and watch though

[harriebird]

you'd be most welcome :grin2 and bring loopy too :grin2

are you guys ok after your off(s)? :cuddle

[stu600cc]

Yeah we are good afew more bruises come up knee still hurts

thx for asking

[harriebird]

no worries, it's bruise central here :rolleyes: i really never thought there were that many shades of purple and yellow :grin3

how are your bikes?

[stu600cc]

yeah they are fine both damged generator covers and worn down R@G's .Will get some piucs up soon


My Fieldsheer leathers after sliding down the road at about 130mph on my arse there is not even a slight hole in them

[harriebird]

oops gettting a bit :offtopic: oh well, never mind!

thank **** for R&Gs huh, mine totally saved my side panel. the tail is trashed but the side and nose cone is a bit scuffed but that's about all.

i rang them today, you can just buy a single bung if you need to - nice one :grin2

heal quick and get back out there again soon.....i know i'm gonna come off at some point on the track this year, but i don't want to wreck Dave's gorgeous paint job!

He has suggested the perfect excuse for going slow - so everyone can admire his handiwork :grin2 ta again dave :cuddle

good work on the leathers too.....dead cow, you just can't beat it!

[stu600cc]

R @ G's are a must anyone without them

GET SOME!!!!

[SDM]

................10 riders, 10% off. Any more than that we can discuss further offers.

Like..........

15 riders, 15% off
20 riders, 20% off

100 riders, free.............:grin2

only joking, thanks MSV

[NitroDaze]

Hi there, welcome to EB. Thanks for the info on the MSV trackdays. There's loads of poeple on here that love doing track days! :grin2

Information on our gatherings, including group track days that are organised (there were quite a few last year!) are in a private section of the website that members can apply to join ;) :D
I have never done a track day yet. I love to have a go this year. So if one is being organized, l shall be happy to join in.
Which track is easiest to learn for a newbie? I live closer to brands, but l hear it is difficult, fibbs or nay?

[STEALTH52]

I have never done a track day yet. I love to have a go this year. So if one is being organized, l shall be happy to join in.
Which track is easiest to learn for a newbie? I live closer to brands, but l hear it is difficult, fibbs or nay?

im doing my first one this year too, just organising a track bike first, think snettertons the best to learn on first time from what ive been told, but im happy to learn on whatever. think theres going to be a few organised ones through the site so will probably go wherever.

[Lateshift]

I have to say that any track is difficult to learn if you expect to go out and be as quick as you think you are ;)

Treat the whole track day thing as a learning experience and take your time to settle into a rythm that you feel comfortable at, exactly the same as you would on the road and you will be fine, if you havent ridden the track then think about just going into the corners at the speed you feel comfortable with until you feel more confident, then worry about whether or not you want to go faster.

You shouldnt be worried about doing them, granted there are a few circuits with a few surprises to them, but as i said if you treat each one with the same respect you give to any corner on the road then you will soon get used to them :)

[Lateshift]

im doing my first one this year too, just organising a track bike first, think snettertons the best to learn on first time from what ive been told, but im happy to learn on whatever. think theres going to be a few organised ones through the site so will probably go wherever.

I dont think Snetterton would be the best to learn on, extremely fast corners and a back straight a kilometre long ;)

If you want to learn track craft then i would put my hand on my heart and say that a circuit with the same amount of rights and lefts, medium length straights and the odd hairpin and chicane would be the best blend to give you a proper ride, something like Rockingham International or the National one ;)

For what its worth, Brands Indy might seem daunting but most think that because of Paddock bend and Hailwood hill, its not difficult to get right on a track day, lets face it the bike is controlled by you so if you take a steady approach to it until you are confident then there is no reason why you cant learn on a short circuit like that :)

Its only when you need to be upping the pace that corners (especially like Paddock) become critical for throttle control and braking :)

Me and Jules hadnt been there and we got Perilous to talk us through his lines around the circuit and depsite the weather it was fantastic there :)

[NitroDaze]

I dont think Snetterton would be the best to learn on, extremely fast corners and a back straight a kilometre long ;)

If you want to learn track craft then i would put my hand on my heart and say that a circuit with the same amount of rights and lefts, medium length straights and the odd hairpin and chicane would be the best blend to give you a proper ride, something like Rockingham International or the National one ;)

For what its worth, Brands Indy might seem daunting but most think that because of Paddock bend and Hailwood hill, its not difficult to get right on a track day, lets face it the bike is controlled by you so if you take a steady approach to it until you are confident then there is no reason why you cant learn on a short circuit like that :)

Its only when you need to be upping the pace that corners (especially like Paddock) become critical for throttle control and braking :)

Me and Jules hadnt been there and we got Perilous to talk us through his lines around the circuit and depsite the weather it was fantastic there :)
Most encouraging Lateshift. Thanks, I look forward to it.

[STEALTH52]

im with you on that one lateshift, the main reason i want to do a track day is to improve my riding in general & my cornering, granted a track is totally different to the road, but at least it gives me the time to learn to improve my riding & experiment a bit without the worry of something coming the other way or not knowing whats around the next corner. i.e parked car, or a nice pile of horse dung in the summer!!! when you all decide to book a track day can you let me know & i'll up for it.

[DoodleBug]

Its only when you need to be upping the pace that corners (especially like Paddock) become critical for throttle control and braking :)

:( only advice I can give is to watch how I ride, and then try to find the completely opposite technique, you should be fine.

[stu600cc]

I wanna do snetterton next maybe in a couple of months

Wanna do it before they do it up

All tracks are good to learn like latey says "take it at your own pace".

[Perilous]

im doing my first one this year too, just organising a track bike first, think snettertons the best to learn on first time from what ive been told, but im happy to learn on whatever. think theres going to be a few organised ones through the site so will probably go wherever.

Disagree there.

Snetterton is a featureless circuit with zero or negative cambers on most corners.

Having instructed there, unless you make novices follow you the classic 600 and above riders approach is to get sucked into going as fast as their bike will down the back straight from the off. They then end up in an unusual left hand bend that is taken on closed throttle scrubbing off a lot of speed (most people know the throttle is normally rollled on proressively through a corner) before having to chuck it into a very accute relatively slow speed, negative camber, (the track guide says 0 camber, I disagree) right hander.
This whole situation seems to confuse novices.
Even in the sighting laps I had people go straight on at the end of the straight. (Even one where I religioulsy kept to 70mph on the straight)

Also Coram a very fast corner runs straight the hideous Russell Chicane with a secong or first gear exit.

Ok if you can contain yourself enough on the straight to take the Esses in the standard manner (positive throttle) until you get the hang of it great and the same for Russell, but what I've seen from novice trackdayers there (I don't mean inexperienced road riders) is they either, bin it, just get put off or just toddle round (straights excluded) and learn very little.

A couple of trackdays down the line then yeah its great. Theres nothing like going into the Esses on a 600 plus whatever with the back end fishtailing as you brake, desperately tring to scrub off speed into the left hander then grinning like a maniac as you force the bike upright and feel the front end lift as you accelerate into the bombhole and even on a 400 there's nothing like the feeling as the back tyre slides and squirms about as you bang it up through the gears round Coram.

I've only done a couple of Rockinghams (and one was a CS School) and both were on the infield but with the combination of one straight into the other corners, the left hander (can't remember the corners there) that sucks you into turning too early and all the other nadgery bits it's probably a case of if you can get the hang of Rockingham you could ride anywhere.

Paddock at Brands. Most novices (and a lot of trackday instructors as it happens) turn in too early.
The only daunting thing about Paddock is that it's a blind downhiller. Other than the down hill part it's no different any other blind bend.
The art to learning Paddock (and this has worked for every one I've said it to) is to get you braking over with very early (so much so that you coast a little bit before you power on) and early enough so you don't have to brake hard.
That way you have time to think and make sure you are turning late enough and have enough speed off to turn the bike nice and quicky.
Chances are someone will go under you at this point but ignore them because they'll run wide and you'll have tons of room to tuck under them if you catch them down the hill.
The braking is right to left diagonaly across the track to take adavantage of the camber to slow you down but for the novice that just adds and extra to think about so it's easier just to be over to the left to start and allow enough braking time.
Remember that down the hill your not just trying to maintain positive throttle but your rolling down hill so you need to throttle on quite quickly.
Once you have the turn point and throttle etc sorted out you can then brake later and later until you remove the coasting bit and then start extending your braking point deeper into the corner and brake harder and of course start braking right to left if traffic allows.


In between sesions ignore the muppets who are harping on about how late they braked for Paddock, if they are in novices they're learning just like you but in reality learning nothing.

For a first trackday (I did my second there) I think Brands Indy is hard to beat. There are only five corners so you don't waste much Brain power learning the general layout but the corners are all technical enough to test your track/roadcraft to the full.

Whatever circuit you choose though, ride at a pace that is slow enough for you to think about what you are doing. Although your average no sense of danger 17 year has an advantage in the b4lls department at the end of the day you ride fast with your brain not the seat of your pants.
Don't let the trackday hero on his third year of trackdays on his R1 bragging in the garage next to you suck you into try too hard mode where you end up not thinking. At the end of the day his 56s might look fast on a track day but in reality for an R1 they're not and your average half decent old TZR 250 would be getting very frustrated being held up by him in the corners. (Actual case from last year:) )

Right can't put it off any longer I'm off to turn my bike yellow.:( :grin2

[harriebird]

i found the Silverstone National circuit that a few of us did together as our first trackday to be an excellent choice. a good balance of everything, and nice and wide so people could get past easily if they wanted too, leaving plenty of room. Plus acres of run off at Copse, as a couple of folks decided to find out :grin2

it wouldnt be my first choice to go back to, but it was good as a first one - a nice straight, couple of faster corners and a couple of tight ones too :grin2

Rockingham is also excellent, i would do that every week if i could - probably because it's the first track where i really started to feel a little smidgen of confidence coming through, even in the wet :skip probably the favourite for me.

Brands i enjoyed, again even in the ****ing rain i really enjoyed myself, i just found it hard to get a decent line once i had got round Graham Hill. i had been so relieved to still be alive after Paddock and Graham Hill i didnt really think about the rest :grin2

So i am open to all available advice on Brands Indy, seeing as my first race is there soon :laughboun

[Perilous]

So i am open to all available advice on Brands Indy, seeing as my first race is there soon

Well as far as Paddock goes for racing what I said doesn't really apply, it's really just meant for early track day riders. For racing I'd have thought you'd already be on brake late right to left, turn hard and late, lob it on it's side and nail it down the hill as hard as the rear tyre will stand.;)

[harriebird]

i was braking really late, but jules was braking earlier, she was saying something about the marshal post but i didnt really understand. every time i came to go down the hill, i got caught by a MASSIVE gust of wind that blew me leftwards :eek:

how do you mean when you say you are braking left to right, or right to left?

the lines i was struggling with were after graham hill, where there were a load of bends that just seemed to all run into each other, didnt' have a clue :rolleyes:

don't forget i'm only a baby racer! ;)

[Perilous]

don't forget i'm only a baby racer! ;)

Yeah sorry that last post was a bit unfair for someone on their first outing.

was braking really late, but jules was braking earlier

That's because Jules was doing what i told her to do;). Get the bike settled early and concentrate on the corner speed.
Hence the reason that on that track day out of the EBers I saw (Tark Excluded obviously) Jule's line and throttle control through Surtees was by far the best because that was the one she'd decided to concentrate on the most. In fact it was better than mine have been on the last two track days and in the one session novice session I saw it was reflected in her lap times.

Trying to late brake before you've learnt a corner uses too much concentration. Once you learnt to set your speed and line for the corner then you can practice pushing out your brake markers.
Wind is an excuse. If you have the throttle on properly and the bike on line it takes an absolute hurricane to knock you off line badly a Paddock. Rather than trying to brake as late as possible you'd have been better to have concentrated getting the bike slowed enough so you could turn it quickly and modify your line slightly to compensate for for the wind.
That way you'd have been able to carry plenty of throttle down the hill and the bike wouldn't have pushed wide because you had turned in early or hadn't been able to get the bike turned quickly because you were hanging on the brake and were backing off halfway down the hill.

If you'd have watched Tark at Paddock you'd have seen he did no heroic braking off the straight (bearing in mind his braking would still be late for a track day) he'd got himself slowed enough to get the bike pointed where he wanted it to go and consequently raher than get pushed to the curb by the wind he was able to carry so much throttle the back end of the bike he was on was squirming about before he picked it up at the bottom of the hill.

Incidently if you do a CSS school they make you circulate without using the brakes at all in a few sessions.

The track is banked right to left into Paddock (left being highest in case I worded that wrong) so much so that from pole to grid three I can't touch the ground with my right foot.
If you run from right to left in a shallow diagonal line you can use the hill to to shorten your braking distance.
Having said this though I've made up more places when coming from the back of the grid or a Phil special bad start by going straight down the left and riding round everything. You do of course have to hope no one looses it going in if you do that.

Having said all this every EBer on that track day did well considering how greasy it was.:)

[Perilous]

Sorry I'm flitting on and off here when i get bored of drilling fairings and stuff.

I've just read your post again. Missed a bit.

With regards to Surtees there's not much I can tell you about it you can't just read in the track guide then adapt to suit the Ducati to be honest.

[harriebird]

I realised Jules was taking your advice, she did credit you for it :clap I just wasnt really listening properly, i get a bit carried away on trackdays with all the excitement :grin2

I wasn't intentionally braking late, it was just how i thought it done best. but then talking to Jules it was clear she was doing it differently. So i wanted to listen and learn, i really did as i find her great to watch and learn from but just can't f**king catch her..... :grin2

think i'd better get the circuit guide then....

[Perilous]

think i'd better get the circuit guide then....

It's worth it although as I say you'll have to adapt it for the Ducati as for example like the 400 you won't have to brake for Surtees you'll just shut off and turn in so the brake markers it gives you are irrelevant for there and it may be that as they're quite heavy with not much horsepower you may even be able to just turn and accelerate all the way through without the need to stay of the throttle a bit like we have too.

I can't give you many hints for a twin because after the two sessions at Brands it's very apparent I haven't worked out how to ride one properly myself yet let alone sort out the best lines etc.:grin2 :grin2 I have to admit with the extra engine braking I was making a right pigs ear of Surtees on the Cagiva.

I realised Jules was taking your advice, she did credit you for it

I can't take much credit, Jules and Mick sussed it out themselves really I just added a few hints to suit the smaller bike.:)

[Lateshift]

I can't take much credit, Jules and Mick sussed it out themselves really I just added a few hints to suit the smaller bike.:)

He lies like dormant syphillliss!, we read the track tips he gave us and went from there, we just took about 50 mph off them and realised we didnt need to brake as much :D

[harriebird]

nice one guys, thank you so much :cuddle

eeeeek not long now :skip

[Tark]

Thanks for the kind words Perilous!!

[Keir_K3]

As no one seems to be getting the ball rolling i will.....

I want to do a Brands GP circuit track day from the middle of april onwards sometime. MSV, please supply dates and prices for this. thanks

[MSV]

At the minute we do not have any confirmed dates for a GP day, but it is something we are looking at doing. If Essex Bikers would want to book, dependant on numbers, you could have your own session.

In the meantime we have quite a few events to choose from, including some new evenings. It would be great if you could come along as a group, or if you get enough riders potentially your own session/evening.

Check out the dates at www.motorsportvision.co.uk/biketrackdays (http://www.motorsportvision.co.uk/biketrackdays), or feel free to call me.

Nick
Track Day Organiser
0870 850 5014

[Tark]

Cool! Can I be an Instructor please?? Hottrax said I could some time but i never finalised anything..

[stu600cc]

Any Snetterton dates???????

[MSV]

Hi,

For all dates (including Snetterton) visit www.motorsportvision.co.uk/trackdaycalendar (http://www.motorsportvision.co.uk/trackdaycalendar).

Have you got a group of you who would want to come along to one of our days yet? If you pick a date, then get people to add their name to it if they want to come along. One of you act as the co-ordinator and give me a call. 10 riders, 10% per booking.

With regards to becoming an instructor, please feel free to give my colleague Alex Baker a call on 0870 850 5013.

Thanks

Nick
Track Day Organiser
0870 850 5014