how i have gone about starting my race season :D

[harriebird]

i shall leave aside the yada yada about should i/shouldn' i etc :grin2

to be a racer of any kind you have to have an ACU licence. This costs £42 for a licence.

To get a licence you have to attend a Competitor Training Course relevant to the type of racing you want to do, e.g. road racing. This costs £50.

You can do this either as a 4 hour session at ACU House in Rugby, or i believe you can do it as part of a track-based course where you get to do a grid start and get a bit of track time. These are run by lots of the road racing clubs prior to the start of the season and are in the region of £100 i think.

after the 4 hours, you have to do a little multiple choice test to make sure you have been listening. it's a doddle. the only one i got wrong out of 19 questions was how old you had to be before you didnt need your parents to sign you on etc :rolleyes:

You get a certificate once you have attended said course. if you have done trackdays then most of it isnt new (flags etc) but there were a few fab snippets of information wedged in among the general gnarly old racer banter (which i could listen to all day anyway) - some technical stuff about lockwiring/what to take and also some general bits :grin2

as well as said certificate, you have to have an eye test. some opticians charge for this, but i was cheeky and since i had had an eye test recently, i just went back and asked if they could sign my form based on my existing eye test results, therefore saving me a few quid. thank you Boots of Billericay :clap

I am in quite good physical health (we wont mention the mental health hehehe) so i didnt need a medical. there's a question and answer section on the licence application form and you just tick the boxes.

you also need a passport sized photo :grin2

once all my form was done, i wrote a cheque for £49.50 - £42 for my licence and £7.50 for my sexy orange novice bib :grin2

you don't have to have a road licence to race - if you do then you are an Intermediate Novice (send a copy of your road licence with the ACU form). if not you are a Novice. easy.

now comes the science bit - CONCENTRATE :laugh1 - to get an ACU licence you have to be a memeber of a road racing club (e.g. Bemsee/BMCRC, New Era, Derby Phoenix, North Gloucester etc).

BUT to join a road racing club you have to have an ACU licence! chicken/egg or what :grin2

so what you do is you get all your ACU paperwork together, and your cheque, and send it off to the membership secretary of your chosen club. They countersign your ACU application (in effect saying you're joining) and then they send it off for you so it all kinda happens together.

STILL WITH ME AT THE BACK THERE????!

that's it. wait for your shiny ACU licence to come through the post and then feel all butterfly-y (thats not a word i know that!)

So. to race you need your ACU licence, a bike and a dogtag.

The dogtag has to have as a minimum your name and date of birth. if you know it you can put your blood group on. top tip from ACU instructor - do not guess your blood group - how we laughed :grin3

if you have any other medical gubbins then put that on - e.g. i'm asthmatic and when i crash i tend to hyperventilate so i can get myself in a panic quite quick :rolleyes:

next post....all about my bike :grin2

[harriebird]

My bike.

I race in the Ducati Sporting Club's Desmodue championship which is run by New Era MCC.

There are 2 classes for this -Class A is for the newer fuel injected 620cc Monsters/Supersports/Multistradas (yes really!) and Class B is for the older 583cc carb model Monsters and SSs.

Class B is aimed at novice racers who have maybe done a couple of trackdays and fancy trying something a bit more lively. Some people in this class are total novices (e.g. me) and some have had a couple or a few years race experience.

Class A is rather more competitive.

Basically we are very limited on what we can do to the bikes, other than handling/safety mods.

Tyres are standard road going Diablo Corsas. you can have as many sets as you like in the season, but wet or dry, cold or hot, that's what you get.

You can fit a Dynojet Stage 2 kit and K&N/other air filter. It's a good idea to have high level cans (if you have a monster) for ground clearance, and if they're race cans (which of course they're gonna be!) then you might need to adjust fuelling etc. etc.

You can have any shock you like, a steering damper if you like, whatever really.

It's advisable to fit rearsets again for ground clearance. Mine were £85, no blingy Harris ones for me - these were made up to a design done by one of the other DD racers and they're lovely.

I have got clip ons because i'm used to that riding position but that's personal choice (also the tank's quite long and standard bars are too wide for my dinky little arms)

You HAVE to have a belly pan that's up to a certain spec, has to hold a certain capacity of oil etc (no one has ever checked mine, i just asked around and made sure mine is the same as other racers :laugh1 ) My belly pan cost me £55 from ebay and it's a Ducati Performance carbon number - very nice until i scuffed it to bits at donny last weekend!

you can do what you like with the brakes - i have a single disc but some people have twin discs (the early monsters were single). i have Performance Friction pads too, very nice. you HAVE to have stainless steel braided lines as per ACU regs.

So.

My bike cost me £826 from ebay.

I have spent to date

£30 new belts as the bike had been stood for years
£75 braided lines
£75 chain and sprockets
£40 oil
£50 GSXR clip ons - second hand from another racer
£206 Sil Motor hi level race cans - second hand from the same person
£55 belly pan - second hand from ebay
£55 R&G crash bungs
£30 brake pads
£85 rearsets
£150 tyres
£35 and a ginger cake - fandabbydozey paint job by bigbikefan :cuddle

the other big item of expenditure for me was my one piece leathers - essential for racing. I was bloody lucky and my kind sponsor and good friend David who runs www.solocorse.co.uk (http://www.solocorse.co.uk) sorted me out a set at cost.

off the peg just wasnt an option for me at five foot nowt with a trashed right ankle.....

i bought a decent back protector too for £55 but i would have got one for trackdays anyway.

i think that's everything.

Race entries are £100-135 a weekend for the first two races (includes at least one practice session).

Other than that it's diesel for my van (also acts as my car when it decides it wants to run) and grub. We're quite a happy little team so take it in turns to buy the food/beer/whatever else floats your boat.

Oh and if you crash then that will cost you too :grin2

[harriebird]

so in a nutshell, i have justified it as no more expensive than doing one trackday a month and having a dedicated track bike.

it's a weekend away with my mates with some track time thrown in. my lap times improved by the end of the weekend and i've had a ball.

i'm making the most of my life and doing something i was always a bit put off by because i thought girls didnt do it/I couldnt do it/people would think i was silly to try etc.

i was inspired by my friend Lin who went racing for the first time ever at late 30-something, because she fancied a go and wanted to try something new. Her Monster (Max) had been all over the world with her and it was a new chapter in his life too :grin2 she gave me her race number (6) before she emigrated and i was thrilled :cuddle

others who have contributed wisdom/funds/support/assistance/shoulders are Graeme/zimbo, the fabulous Perilous, Trouty and all my fab mates off here and ducatisti. :cuddle

next race is at Assen this weekend! :jumping2 :jumping2 :jumping2

[gixer400]

Good read there Harrie :)

Its not as pricey as I thought it would be, but I bet it racks up.

Good luck for your following races.

[harriebird]

forgot to mention, if any of the more seasoned racers among us would liek to correct anything i have written then please feel free :grin2

it does mount up, but it's worth it imho. i hardly spend my money on anything else, i dont go out much and i'm not really into spending a fortune on clothes and shoes.

some people go mad on what they spend racing wise, but my good friend Graeme has spent about the same as me and has had two 3rd places already this season.

[Perilous]

the only one i got wrong out of 19 questions was how old you had to be before you didnt need your parents to sign you on etc :rolleyes:


I had to ask some one that and I was instructing on the rookie day at the time.:rolleyes: :grin2

[Tark]

I used to have to take my dad with me for the first 3 seasons to sign for me.. LOL

[harriebird]

:grin2 so i bet you'd know the answer then!

[Perilous]

To emphasis what a nice cheap entry class Desmodue is and put it in perspective with relation to what Banditmad was saying about racing 600s that amounts to a couple of hundred quid more than a front running Bemsee 600 engine refresh. (Not the original tune) It's not unusual for a full spec 600 to need three of those in a season.
My team mate's engine costs last season were £5000 and his bike wasn't anywhere near the quickest in a straight line.
Then you have £1500 special built radiators and so on and so on.
Then its 2 tyres every meeting sometimes three (two rears). Wets if it rains and drys out during your race.
Not sure about the others but the time before a tuned R6 picks up on the big ends running on its side after a crash is in the region of three seconds unless you are very lucky.

so as Tark basically said in the other thread, there is no such thing as 'just' racing a 600 unless you don't mind being uncompetetive.

At £12000 up front, a couple of tyres thrown in each meeting and the bike at the end of it the Triumph 675 class is considered cheap.

[Perilous]

:grin2 so i bet you'd know the answer then!


Its actually on the back of your scrut card. I was helping on the trainee scrutineering queue so you can imagine the p take when I shouted out and asked Bemsee's head cheese at the time Dave Stewart of all people. :grin2

[Perilous]

I used to have to take my dad with me for the first 3 seasons to sign for me.. LOL

Yeah its a real pain all that isn't it. I get really fed up of being asked if I'm over 18 everytime I go to the bar.:grin2

[Perilous]

it does mount up, but it's worth it imho.


Yup. :grin2

No holidays in ten years, the house is falling apart, you live at work to pay for it, lose touch with all your non racing mates, drive an old van you resprayed as main transport, need a wife with the patience of a saint that can also handle hearing you declared as dead, you have twice as many more downs from the sport than ups, can expect to know at least one person killed if you race for any length of time* (or get to watch it twice in my case:( ) and stand a very good chance of picking up at least one permanent injury if you try to be at the front , then just one day like yesterday (result are irrelevant) makes all the scrimping and saving, stress and broken bones worthwhile.:) :) :)

A right glamorous sport.:grin2

H'mm anyone know a good psychiatrist.:grin2

Nuuurse nuurse.:grin2


(* Although as a % of people known theres been far more on the road)

[Tark]

Sayign that I just buy a 5 year old bike for about £2-£3K and go for it. Just change the oil every meeting and a set of tyres every meeting or every other. I am no where near spending as much as some of the others in the 600's but I still try my hardest to stay near the front..

[Perilous]

Sayign that I just buy a 5 year old bike for about £2-£3K and go for it. Just change the oil every meeting and a set of tyres every meeting or every other. I am no where near spending as much as some of the others in the 600's but I still try my hardest to stay near the front..

Good advice. and the best way to start.

Steve Mercer actually won the Championship on a standard (engine not chassis) RI but its uncommon.

Barry Chapman in contrast spent £10000 on a tuned GSXer and it blew up first race.

I've always said anyone with a 600 track bike shouldn't whinge about not being able to go and race because all they've got to do is get the licence (minor money with abit of effort) and have a go with the track bike.


As I said it depends on your attitude and to a degree what bike club you run with.

If I'd have run the DP F400 this weekend on Jule's fairly standard 400 track bike I'd have still finished around the same place. I'd have had a bloody good race on my old Aprilia 250 but in Bemsee 400 I'd have been half a lap down from the leaders by the end and been creamed in DPs open 400.

You are capable of running at the front on a competetive bike but if your racing every now and then and happy not to fine, but most people get sucked into the spend spend spend routine unless they run in a budget class.
Also people starting have a nasty tendancy to blame the bike for their lack of results and spend more.

Whatever you say most people who get hooked on racing, unless they are happy to stay in something like Desmodue, (the front running riders I know in that have already blown their money in other classes so they're no different) end up spending a lot of money.

Also people on road riding forums tend to paint a lovely rosy 'oh its just like a bit of Wednesday night go Kart racing' picture of bike racing, but it isn't like that.

Yes people do go on year in year out without a scratch and also manage to stay of their cards, but not many. Again if you're someone who's happy to trundle along at the back so you can just say you've raced you'll probably be fine (although I know two back markers who now have permanent head injury after being hit by front runners lapping them) but if you start trying to compete properly (even in slow airfield type clubs) its extremely likely your gonna get hurt at some point.

Mick Caswell's son James is a prime example.

We have another 400 rider who I used to battle with who seemed invincible, he's in a wheelchair now.

Feisty Racing had a nasty habit of over glaming racing for a while. Their new young 17 year old racer ended up sobbing her heart out after hitting a fallen rider dead centre in his soine at Lydden.

Trouty's lost a mate and I got to watch Duncan Farley get killed in the same class in my first year.

The list can go on and on.

All this doom and gloom aside though I absolutely love it hence at 43 I'm still doing it and racing in the most difficult 400 class I can be in.

Its worth it just for the diversity of characters and proper friends I've made (those you'll see after you pack up) without the racing itself and there is just nothing to compare to first corner in a race and the buzz you get on the days it goes well. :) :) :) :) :)

Trackdays are not even remotely similar.

Its well worth having a go at.

However people do need to go into it with their eyes wide open!!

[NinjaMad]

Thanks lads that really helped, sorry to be cheeky but one other thing i would like to no is what CLubs are ideal to join, im looking for run of the meal class 400 - 600 i dont mind, but start small work up.... SO if there is any chance of what clubs and there competiveness also around south east england then that would be helpful justso i no who i should look to go with.

Cheers again guys

[troutslayer]

great thread, well done harrie, its a well written and concise document.

perilous has summed up (if thats possible?) pretty much perfectly, the life of a club racer a few years down the line.

the racing will cost as much as you throw at it. Racing can be cheap. Winning will cost. Unless your one of life's naturals.

[harriebird]

although i'm not in it for serious competition, i am in full possession of the facts and risks. i dont think it means i take it any less seriously, it just means i dont get so hung up about coming at the back.

i didnt realise how bad i'd feel at mallory when people started getting hurt.

i had a bit of a sniffle waiting to restart at mallory because griff had hurt himself quite badly in race 1, he was sat in the middle of the track totally winded.

we were all waiting for the restart and a helicopter came overhead just after the ambulance/doctors car went round to where he was. i was in a pretty dicey emotional state that weekend anyway, so was feeling a little below par, and i assumed the helicopter was an air ambulance. I totally panicked/flipped my lid and burst into tears. fortunately my mate Andy was sat near me and saw what was happening and held my hand and told me not to be so silly! i'm 28 and it still made me cry, it really brought home to me how dangerous it is.

i dont care if it makes me a big girl :grin2 i doubt people normally cry on restarts though :rolleyes: :grin2

it did make me wonder what the point etc was, but once i was back on the start line for race 2, i was OK.

i'm aware i'm going to crash at some point, i just hope it's not too bad. i'm not in it just to say i've raced though.....i might have been before but not now.

[Perilous]

Thanks lads that really helped, sorry to be cheeky but one other thing i would like to no is what CLubs are ideal to join, im looking for run of the meal class 400 - 600 i dont mind, but start small work up.... SO if there is any chance of what clubs and there competiveness also around south east england then that would be helpful justso i no who i should look to go with.

Cheers again guys

Bemsee is your nearest and probably your cheapest in terms of travel costs.

Bemsee has a rookie 600 class and should still have a rookie 400 championship withhin the main one as I've already said.

NG have probably the cheapest 400 class as they run a stock one but you'll be travelling a lot as they don't race many local circuits to Essex.

Derby Pheonix has some cheap classes but you'll be travelling again.

EMRA (Midlands) have some cheapish 400 and 600 classes if you don't mind just racing at a sh1t hole like Mallory and no where else.

The other alternative is to join one or two and just do the local meets if you don't want to travel.

Start small and work up form 600s the most competetive and expensive class out there. I'm loosing interested now as you're obviously not paying attention to what anyone is telling you.:rolleyes:

[Tark]

Biggest problem for me is that if you have 2 people of equal ability and they have a better/faster (speed not always the key ie suspension set up etc etc) bike you will never beat them unless you ride out of your skin or they make a mistake.. Hence why you crash trying to go round corners faster than a guy who just blew you off on the straight and his bike goes round corners better too..

Although my bike isn't that bad so I cant use it as an excuse. The people who beta me are just better.. I just need to pull my finger out I guess.

[Perilous]

[quote=Tark;110880]Biggest problem for me is that if you have 2 people of equal ability and they have a better/faster (speed not always the key ie suspension set up etc etc) bike you will never beat them unless you ride out of your skin or they make a mistake.. Hence why you crash trying to go round corners faster than a guy who just blew you off on the straight and his bike goes round corners better too..

[quote]

Exactly and at th end of the day its a race so off you go and spend more money on the bike.

I lost count of how many trimes I lost the front on the Aprilia trying to scratch back the ground lost on the straigh tin the corners.

You can look at it how you like but most regularly competing competietive club racers on a 'normal' income end up skint.

[Lateshift]

Rookie 600 to be competitive is taking a stock 600 bike and throwing at least £3000 at it just for starters, as has already been demonstrated this season so far.

If you are doing this for fun then you can't surely want to be spending thousands without wanting to get somewhere with it, if you are a talented rider then fair enough you can get by with what you have in terms of power (as already demonstrated by Sy Langford at Brands in the opening round when his GSXR was putting out 89 at the wheel), however for him to stay ahead of the field his initial engine tune cost £3000 to keep an already new bike at the front of the field.

So the trade off is between enjoying it and having fun with minimal cost, and spending money to develop a bike that is going to be competitive.

600's isnt the place for either because to hang onto the back of the pack costs money in that class as a rookie and having seen the standard this season its not for the faint hearted either :D

Rookie 400 seems to be more realistic if you want to start small (in money terms) and actually learn a bit more track craft too, a track prepared one can be had for a good price, there are plenty of parts available for them and they are a good bike to learn cornering on (where you need to keep corner speed up), again though to be competitive in these classes it costs money.

Desmodue does seem a realistic alternative to all of them for someone that just wants a proper blast on a bike with a more levelled playing field, yes the cost can add up if you want to be a front runner but a Monster can be picked up cheap, and needs very little done to it to make it track ready (as has already been demonstrated) its a one tyre series which means there is no messing around there and given the power of the bike, its going to focus on cornering to get anywhere properly with it, which means you are having to work to race it, rather than just turn up and try to point and squirt it :) (ultimately for most thats a track day!)

How many trackdays have you done out of interest?

[DoodleBug]

More stuff HERE (http://www.bemsee.net/index.php?option=com_easyfaq&Itemid=42)

[troutslayer]

my bikes a class A desmodue, 2002 monster 620. 5 gears model.

It cost £2300 to buy and i've barely done a thing to it since i picked it up. So its amongst the cheapest of the bikes that are on the class A grid, and i'm sat in 9th place in the championship. In fact, all i've done is change oil and pads, alter the (standard shock) rear suspension, and add a bit of weight by putting a fairing onto it.

to put things into a different light, the top 10 DD class A bikes that raced at brands would have been ahead of half the GSXR Cup guys who raced on the same day. Not bad for 60bhp shopping bikes :)

[Lateshift]

I honestly think half of the people that decide at the drop of a hat to go into racing (other than those that are fortunate enough to have been given a leg up and actually start on the 125's) seem to think that 600cc racing is where it all starts, they totally forget for the most part that 99% of the top class riders out there started on lower cc bikes that need to be ridden to show how good the rider is/was rather than having just relied on sheer power to make them look quick.

This is probably why the 600's have historically had the maximum number of riders on the grids and probably the most accidents :D

I think further down the line unless you are taking it up as a full time thing (where it goes beyond being just an expensive hobby) you soon realise that to get anywhere in club racing and stay competitive it isnt just about the talent its about the bank balance (or lack of :D ).

If you take a look at the SB400 class in BMCRC at the moment there are bikes there that will produce the same lap times on most UK circuits that the Rookie 600's and also the Clubman 600's are doing, yet for the Rookie and Clubman 600 bike to achieve that lap time its costing a lot more in terms of bike and initial tuning.

All the racers on here will probably agree (i hear Perilous mention it often enough) that the more you tune a bike, the more it costs, its not progressive either, the last few horsepower costing double what it cost to get it that far too, its the same for every class too.

In the Rookie 600's you wont find a bike thats older than maybe 4 years old and even the back runners are having to produce around 120bhp at the wheel to keep up and that still doesnt stop them getting lapped).

You weigh all that up and then look at bikes like an RS125 doing a couple of seconds slower, and wonder if spending nearly £10,000 on a bike to begin with was all worth it, when the RS125 rider is probably having just the same level of enjoyment :)

[Perilous]

All the racers on here will probably agree (i hear Perilous mention it often enough) that the more you tune a bike, the more it costs, its not progressive either, the last few horsepower costing double what it cost to get it that far too, its the same for every class too.



It just cost another 600 quid to get half a bike length on the straight at Snetterton on my nearest rival. But that's a wheel and a bit ahead at the turn in point.

[harriebird]

as has already been stated, success in Desmodue is reliant on carrying really good corner speed. and carrying it all the way through the corner, not just braking late etc.

imho this has got to be transferrable to any other bike you ride.

i have already noticed a massive difference in my body position when i'm riding on the road. i dont go faster on the road, mainly because i'm more scared riding on the road now than i ever was before :eek:

[Perilous]

to put things into a different light, the top 10 DD class A bikes that raced at brands would have been ahead of half the GSXR Cup guys who raced on the same day. Not bad for 60bhp shopping bikes :)
__________________


That's fair comment and can be said of a lot of classes.

My 400 lap times at our first Brands meeting (off my best) would have put me in the top 7 against 180 BHP bikes in the Forza extreme class at the same meeting but there is a world of difference in racing a 400 to a tuned GSXR 1000.

Moto GP is purposely run to avoid the twisty tracks where the 250s would post better lap times but what bike would you rather race, a GP 800 or a 250.

[Perilous]

as has already been stated, success in Desmodue is reliant on carrying really good corner speed. and carrying it all the way through the corner, not just braking late etc.

imho this has got to be transferrable to any other bike you ride.

i have already noticed a massive difference in my body position when i'm riding on the road. i dont go faster on the road, mainly because i'm more scared riding on the road now than i ever was before :eek:

Yeah fair enough and a good comment but if you want to learn corner speed as regards moving on to faster bikes you ride a two stroke.

That or a very similar handling bike that has 56 geg of safe lean angle so the tyres slide before the exhaust and belly pan deck out.

[troutslayer]

as has already been stated, success in Desmodue is reliant on carrying really good corner speed.


and the best way to learn corner speed, is on a 2 stroke. because there is NO other way to ride it other than constantly keeping it within its small powerband rev range and abusing it into the corners :)

my god how i miss the 2 strokes... aksherly, i always fancied doing an endurance round on one...

i'd quite like a go on a gp125, but i know that a: i couldnt ride it to its best, and b: i'll be thrashed by a bunch of 13yr old 6 stone weighing oiks!

[Perilous]

Snap.:grin2

Yup I miss mine too.

[troutslayer]

That's fair comment and can be said of a lot of classes.

My 400 lap times at our first Brands meeting (off my best) would have put me in the top 7 against 180 BHP bikes in the Forza extreme class at the same meeting but there is a world of difference in racing a 400 to a tuned GSXR 1000.

Moto GP is purposely run to avoid the twisty tracks where the 250s would post better lap times but what bike would you rather race, a GP 800 or a 250.

yep, this is true Phil, i was just trying to point out that a £2grand bike/race series with no tuning is more than enough for most folk :) i should also state that the front runner in the gsxrcup was doing incredibly impressive times and i'm sure we'll see more of him in the future (or he was a brands 'specialist'). i have no doubt that by the end of the season, the slower lads will have been pulled up to speed with more experience and confidence :)

personally, i'd rather ride the gp250. now, how about an nsr500?? that would be truly awesome/terrifying!

[Perilous]

That or a very similar handling bike that has 56 geg of safe lean angle so the tyres slide before the exhaust and belly pan deck out.

Actually I put that bit in to be PC for some odd reason. I take it back.

The way to learn corner speed is on a two stroke, end of.:)

[Perilous]

yep, this is true Phil, i was just trying to point out that a £2grand bike/race series with no tuning is more than enough for most folk :) i should also state that the front runner in the gsxrcup was doing incredibly impressive times and i'm sure we'll see more of him in the future (or he was a brands 'specialist'). i have no doubt that by the end of the season, the slower lads will have been pulled up to speed with more experience and confidence :)

personally, i'd rather ride the gp250. now, how about an nsr500?? that would be truly awesome/terrifying!

No i realise what you were getting at but I'm trying to emphasis how people get drawn in to having to go to bigger and faster bikes.
Oddly enough I always found it alot easier to ride the bigger bikes. I struggled for ages with a 400 until, yup you guessed it, I raced a two stroke.:grin2

The most common thing I hear is "do you only still race a 400" (not from racers) despite the fact that outside Snetterton about 80% of the club racers out there can't post the same times on any bike and trackdayers the latest all singing all dancing only touch it on the straight and even then its usually on Snett track days where I always run at least 2 seconds alp slower than I'm capable of.

In fact it's so bad I even often say, "yeah I only race a 400."

Riding bigger faster bikes is a different discipline but you still can't get away from the fact that average two stroke riders nearly always end up at the front when they go to four strokes.:grin2

At the end of the day though you only race bikes the same as what you're on so it doesn't really matter a flying f what you race unless you just like to bull sh1t down the pub but then its usually only back markers who feel the need to do that.

[Perilous]

Sorry I did get the 500 two stroke bit but I had to have a little lie down after reading it.:grin2 :grin2

[troutslayer]

i been on the look out for porn :)

http://digilander.libero.it/tortugamotoclub/strano/curvare-doohan.jpg

http://hibernia.jakma.org/~paul/doohan-slide.jpg

http://webmoteros.iespana.es/webmoteros/980823biaggi_impenna.jpg

http://www.bikehps.com/acatalog/Suzuki_Pepsi_500GP_42562.jpg

http://www.rgv.ru/img/diff/shwantz/1990SeriesKevinSchwantz.jpg

[troutslayer]

nuts.

sorry harrie. we've just turned your well written and useful thread, into a middle aged guys 2 stroke porn thread. again.

[Perilous]

Middle aged. speak for yourself, I'm only 18.:grin2

H'm yeah, sorry Harrie.:o

[harriebird]

it's fine by me, Doohan is a god! the ONLY replica lid i would ever contemplate! :party1

nice to see him on the MotoGP on sunday too.

but umm.....yeah this one is meant to be about all the bits you need to do to start racing. i guess idolising 2-stroke GP gods counts as essential!

[Perilous]

When i was doing one of my two stroke course at the yamaha training centre they had one of the TZ 750s in there.

When the guy started it up it made the hairs on the back of your kneck stand up. Luvvely .:grin2

He spent a day showing me how to tune my 250 LC while I was there. I made a righ tpigs ear of that.:grin2 good job the GPO truch ran it over and wrote it off.:grin2

Mick Doohan. He's a natioanl hero with the Aussies I used to work with up London.

[harriebird]

and rightly so.

i had an injury similar to one of his, i was lucky enough not to have to wear the lovely Doohan cage but only by a whisker. took me ages to get back to full fitness so for him to be racing as soon as he did after that injury is beyond inspirational :clap

mind you i get a wimpy weedy sore throat from 2 stroke oil. it was really bad after mallory. ashamed to call myself a biker etc etc :rolleyes:

[Perilous]

and rightly so.

iso for him to be racing as soon as he did after that injury is beyond inspirational :clap



The wage helps.;)

as Brian Simpson said when i started back in 2004 on my crutches. "You don't need to be able to walk to ride a bike.":grin2 (Advancedly stupid perhaps.:grin2 )

[NinjaMad]

Bemsee is your nearest and probably your cheapest in terms of travel costs.

Bemsee has a rookie 600 class and should still have a rookie 400 championship withhin the main one as I've already said.

NG have probably the cheapest 400 class as they run a stock one but you'll be travelling a lot as they don't race many local circuits to Essex.

Derby Pheonix has some cheap classes but you'll be travelling again.

EMRA (Midlands) have some cheapish 400 and 600 classes if you don't mind just racing at a sh1t hole like Mallory and no where else.

The other alternative is to join one or two and just do the local meets if you don't want to travel.

Start small and work up form 600s the most competetive and expensive class out there. I'm loosing interested now as you're obviously not paying attention to what anyone is telling you.:rolleyes:

Apologies mate i def am going into 400's thanks for your assistance

[Keir_K3]

see my other post about my nc30 for sale if your looking for a bike.....

[Perilous]

Nc 30 isn't a bad starter bike for racing, ( although the NC35 is better) I raced one myself.
A well set up NC 30 or 35 far out handles the ZXRs.

However, an NC30 or 35 costs extactly 3 times as much to tune as the ZXR 400. They're a bitch for overheating in race conditions and need refreshing at least once in a season, so if you want to progress on 400s they're one of the dearest options.

Another option is the FZR and they are the lightest and tuned ones produce the most outright horsepower (BDK have a 95BHP one if you have £20,000 to spare:grin2 ). FZRs though are getting very hard to get engine parts for and as the saying goes a standard FZR racing is a hand grenade and a tuned one is a hand grenade with the pin out.
The average racer getting results on an FZR usually runs on the one engine in the bike, one in the van and one being repaired at the tuners.
A classic for the FZR is to miss a gear, have a valve collet drop out when they bounce, the valve to drop onto the piston which then snaps the con rod which then goes on to saw the engine cases in half. Seen it loads of times.
There is one rider running reasonably OK on a CBR but mostly they're a waste of time. They handle sweet but like they're early big brother the blade the engine cases drag on the floor and they are very hard to get any decent horse power from so again if you want to progress they're not a good option.

The choice now is really between the RVF or the ZXR, or a VFR with the RVF front end in it.

For general cost effectivness, availabilty of parts and competetiveness the ZXR is the best option.
ZXRs have been finshing in the top three in both Bemsee and the MRO championship for at least the last eight years.
I was beaten to second in the championship in 2005 by an RVf but he spent mega bucks on that.
The same with Pat who runs in our class. He is an exceptional rider and the NC30 he rides does well but it has had fortunes spent on it realtive to a ZXR and he fights a permanent battle with overheating and other engine niggles now its tuned.

ZXR is the way to go. You can start with a standard cheap track bike to have ago or buy a full spec one from the start. a full spec one will almost deffinitly need refreshing though before its raced much though.
Unless you do loads of trackdays and stuff even a ful spec ZXR will do a full season without a refresh.
The downside of any 400 if you go the tuned route is that there is no one local capable or interested in tuning them.
All tuning stuff aside though if you race with Bemsee even though they're dropping the 'easy peasy clubman class' there'll always be some rookies or some slower ones at the back to have a race against even on a £800 standard ZXR but at least you will have started with the right bike if you get hooked and sell your soul to the bank manager.:grin2

Unless you're very quick form the start you can get away with buying tyres second hand from the front runners to start with. Once you get quicker though tyres will be your biggest outlay. Even the faster guys in alledgly budget classes like TZRs put new tyres on every meeting these days in Bemsee.

At front pace a rear Supercorsa will do 4 heat cycles before you're lap times start to drop off.
I have pushed a front out to 7 races but its usually been race 7 crash on the 8th.
1 0r 2 seconds off the pace though (quicker than rookie championship or Clubman winning times, gifted youngsters aside and they'll last much longer.)

[Perilous]

Although completley contradicting myself, i did run low 52s in my last race at Brands Sunday on a front that had done two test days and I'm not sure how many races but at least two, so they will stick but in the circumstances of that race (Chasing a guy running a low 51 fastest lap) I'd of probably gone faster on a newer tyre that wasn't moving around so much.

Ultimately how much tyres cost will depend on how fast you are but going fast works on the same basis of diminishing returns as engine tuning with the last few tenths in lap times being infintely dearer than the first few seconds so ultimately the tyre costs will be your biggest expense if you turn out to be any good at it.

[NinjaMad]

thanksfor that i have used your advise and been looking at ZXR's for about a few days thanks again for all your help mate owe ya one